Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

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Loki@99
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Posts: 234
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Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by Loki@99 »

Hi,

There is a room for improvement with the pencil tool.

PDFXCE 10.3.0 build 386
Windows 11 23H2 22631.3593
Huawei Matebook E 2022
M-Pencil 2nd gen


Steps to reproduce :
Reproduce this drawing with these settings (don't draw too fast):
Smooth level: Low
Border: Solid
Width profile : Select the first one below Auto.

g.gif

As you can see, there are some abnormal spikes sometimes.

Smooth Level : Low
image.png

For your reference, there is no such issue with Microsoft Edge, OneNote, Drawboard PDF

Perfect line quality on Microsoft Edge
edg.gif

I would assume that setting Smooth Level to high really improves the line quality but there are still some little spikes. I used the low level Smooth setting above so that you can well notice the spikes.

Smooth Level : High
image(1).png

Btw, it will be great if you can reduce latency even further to match Microsoft OneNote's latency. I understand that processing a PDF is different but maybe it can be still improved.

Thanks for investigating,
Last edited by Loki@99 on Thu May 16, 2024 7:17 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Major Stylus topics
- RemoveAnnotationsWithEraser T#6903
- MiniPopupMenuOnTextSelection T#6894
- AbnormalSpikes forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?p=179935&hilit=spikes#p179935
- ForceEraserPreview forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?t=42380
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Paul - Tracker Supp
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Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by Paul - Tracker Supp »

Hi, Loki@99

do you have a sample PDF? I tried to reproduce this and must be doing something wrong.

I am keen to see your example.
Best regards

Paul O'Rorke
Tracker Support North America
http://www.tracker-software.com
Loki@99
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Posts: 234
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Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by Loki@99 »

Hi Paul,

Well, it's a very random issue not related to specific files. Maybe you can try with a large scanned PDF file to see how it goes .

All I can tell is that the first Width Profile and Low smooth level makes the issue more reproducible.
Major Stylus topics
- RemoveAnnotationsWithEraser T#6903
- MiniPopupMenuOnTextSelection T#6894
- AbnormalSpikes forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?p=179935&hilit=spikes#p179935
- ForceEraserPreview forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?t=42380
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TrackerSupp-Daniel
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Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by TrackerSupp-Daniel »

Hello, Loki@99

I have managed to reproduce this, and am now showing the Dev team. Hopefully they have some ideas for a resolution.
In the meantime, avoiding the "low" smoothing option should help notably.

Kind regards,
Dan McIntyre - Support Technician
Tracker Software Products (Canada) LTD

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Our Web site domain and email address has changed as of 26/10/2023.
https://www.pdf-xchange.com
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Loki@99
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Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by Loki@99 »

TrackerSupp-Daniel wrote: Thu May 16, 2024 5:17 pm Hello, Loki@99

I have managed to reproduce this, and am now showing the Dev team. Hopefully they have some ideas for a resolution.
In the meantime, avoiding the "low" smoothing option should help notably.

Kind regards,
Hi Daniel,

Thanks for checking again,
Major Stylus topics
- RemoveAnnotationsWithEraser T#6903
- MiniPopupMenuOnTextSelection T#6894
- AbnormalSpikes forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?p=179935&hilit=spikes#p179935
- ForceEraserPreview forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?t=42380
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TrackerSupp-Daniel
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Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by TrackerSupp-Daniel »

:)
Dan McIntyre - Support Technician
Tracker Software Products (Canada) LTD

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Our Web site domain and email address has changed as of 26/10/2023.
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Loki@99
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Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by Loki@99 »

Hi,

Is there any update on this issue ?

Hope that it can be fixed in next build.
Major Stylus topics
- RemoveAnnotationsWithEraser T#6903
- MiniPopupMenuOnTextSelection T#6894
- AbnormalSpikes forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?p=179935&hilit=spikes#p179935
- ForceEraserPreview forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?t=42380
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TrackerSupp-Daniel
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Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by TrackerSupp-Daniel »

Hello, Loki@99

I cannot promise a timeline on anything at the moment. The dev team is very busy with the large influx of reports we have seen, particularly the small group who are fluent with touch/stylus related items. They are working through as many as is possible, but at this time I do not have a comprehensive list available.

Kind regards,
Dan McIntyre - Support Technician
Tracker Software Products (Canada) LTD

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Our Web site domain and email address has changed as of 26/10/2023.
https://www.pdf-xchange.com
Support@pdf-xchange.com
Loki@99
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Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by Loki@99 »

Hi Daniel,

Thanks for your input,

I understand.

Best regards,
Major Stylus topics
- RemoveAnnotationsWithEraser T#6903
- MiniPopupMenuOnTextSelection T#6894
- AbnormalSpikes forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?p=179935&hilit=spikes#p179935
- ForceEraserPreview forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?t=42380
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TrackerSupp-Daniel
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Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by TrackerSupp-Daniel »

:)
Dan McIntyre - Support Technician
Tracker Software Products (Canada) LTD

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Loki@99
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Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2023 11:09 am

Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by Loki@99 »

Hi,

I noticed that the issue is also reproducible when using the stylus perpendicularly to make dots.

Smooth Level : Low
Pencil Tool Width : 72 pt

Stroke issue.gif
Major Stylus topics
- RemoveAnnotationsWithEraser T#6903
- MiniPopupMenuOnTextSelection T#6894
- AbnormalSpikes forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?p=179935&hilit=spikes#p179935
- ForceEraserPreview forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?t=42380
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Tracker Supp-Stefan
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Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by Tracker Supp-Stefan »

Hello Loki@99,

Thanks for the sample gif file.
I am unable to reproduce that with a mouse - so I suspect that slight movement of your stylus while inputting those dots is causing the issue. I will ask Dan and the devs who have access to a touch enabled device to run some further tests.

Kind regards,
Stefan
Loki@99
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Posts: 234
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Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by Loki@99 »

Hi Stefan,

Thanks for checking.

Indeed, I also tried with a touchpad and there was no issue so it's specific to stylus.

Looking forward for those who have a touch device to investigate this major stylus issue,
Major Stylus topics
- RemoveAnnotationsWithEraser T#6903
- MiniPopupMenuOnTextSelection T#6894
- AbnormalSpikes forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?p=179935&hilit=spikes#p179935
- ForceEraserPreview forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?t=42380
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TrackerSupp-Daniel
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Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by TrackerSupp-Daniel »

Hello, Loki@99

I have managed to reproduce this one as well, like the other in this topic, they appear to have the same root cause. I will be showing the Dev team shortly.
RT#6947: Bug: Stylus "dots" are too sensitive to movement.

Kind regards,
Dan McIntyre - Support Technician
Tracker Software Products (Canada) LTD

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Our Web site domain and email address has changed as of 26/10/2023.
https://www.pdf-xchange.com
Support@pdf-xchange.com
Loki@99
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Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by Loki@99 »

Hi,

I tested to reproduce the dots issue with finger touch and there was no issue. However, I found is that sometimes PDFXCE doesn't register the touch input (see 10th and 16th dot in GIF below)

Preferences > Commenting : Allow Draw with a Finger Touch enabled
Smooth level : low
Width : 72 pt

Action performed with finger touch
Touch.gif


The abnormal spikes issue is still reproducible when drawing with finger touch.

Smooth level : low
Width : 4 pt

Action performed with finger touch
Touch issue.gif
image.png


Seems like this issue is not only touch/stylus related though. I tried with a wireless mouse and see the abnormal spikes as well.

Smooth level : low
Width : 28 pt

Action performed with a wireless mouse (Logitech M170)
Mouse.gif


Thanks for investigating,
Major Stylus topics
- RemoveAnnotationsWithEraser T#6903
- MiniPopupMenuOnTextSelection T#6894
- AbnormalSpikes forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?p=179935&hilit=spikes#p179935
- ForceEraserPreview forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?t=42380
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TrackerSupp-Daniel
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Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by TrackerSupp-Daniel »

Hello, Loki@99

Thank you for the additional information, I will pass that along.

Kind regards,
Dan McIntyre - Support Technician
Tracker Software Products (Canada) LTD

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Our Web site domain and email address has changed as of 26/10/2023.
https://www.pdf-xchange.com
Support@pdf-xchange.com
Loki@99
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Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2023 11:09 am

Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by Loki@99 »

Hi,

Seems like the issue mentioned in this post is similar to an old one which is wasn't totally fixed.

Thanks in advance for keeping me updated about this issue.
Major Stylus topics
- RemoveAnnotationsWithEraser T#6903
- MiniPopupMenuOnTextSelection T#6894
- AbnormalSpikes forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?p=179935&hilit=spikes#p179935
- ForceEraserPreview forum.pdf-xchange.com/viewtopic.php?t=42380
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TrackerSupp-Daniel
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Re: Pencil tool - small abnormal spikes

Post by TrackerSupp-Daniel »

Hello, Loki@99

I am afraid that there is little to keep track of and report back on here, so I cannot promise that we will be back to post here each time some minor improvement is offered. This has been a long term, gradual task, and will continue to be. While certain cases do necessitate changed to combat outstanding and widespread issue, what you are seeing now, and what was reported in the past there are indeed very similar.
Over time there will be improvements as they are available, and reporting back on each small change over time would amount to nothing substantial being said. It it best to simply keep an eye on the latest updates, and see how things feel with each successive release.

Kind regards,
Dan McIntyre - Support Technician
Tracker Software Products (Canada) LTD

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Our Web site domain and email address has changed as of 26/10/2023.
https://www.pdf-xchange.com
Support@pdf-xchange.com
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