Pencil tool sometimes puts in a circle in middle of line

[Zarquan314]

Sometimes when I am writing using a drawing tablet, the marking will introduce a large circle in the middle of a penstroke. It happens every few minutes of writing. This is a mild annoyance, as I can simply undo the penstroke, but it is annoying as it interrupts my train of thought, but I think it might have to do with momentary freezes, like a stutter, that I notice but otherwise has no effect on my use of the program. However, if my theory is correct, it would likely occur more often on a lower powered computer. Is this a known issue?

I am using version 9.2, build 359.0

[Stefan - PDF-XChange]

Hello Zarquan314,

Could you please try to update to the current build (360) - and see if that helps?
Also - can you please share a screenshot of the unexpected circle and some of the rest of the pencil input that you've been at the time?

Kind regards,
Stefan

[Zarquan314]

I will try to remember to upload a picture. I was thinking I couldn't because I was writing on student papers, but it occurs to be I could just copy the penstroke to an empty document.

This error kept happening until I made the post and then it stopped. I'm thinking that it might be a RAM issue causing the stutters and I closed what was causing the RAM issues.

To explain my theory better, I think that if PDF XChange Editor has a hitch or freeze, it registers a cumulative pen pressure from my drawing tablet on one point for the duration of the hitch. It is as though the pressure readings from the beginning of the hitch to the end were added up over the duration of the hitch and the pencil tool assumes that some ridiculous pressure was applied to the drawing tablet for an instant. In my case, these hitches were probably caused by running out of RAM (caused by web browser tab proliferation).

EDIT: Note that the hitches I describe are not a usability issue in PDF XChange Editor. Other than the circles that can happen, they are barely perceptible.

[Zarquan314]

Here is a small example. The vertical line on the left was drawn normally using my drawing tablet and has a random circle in it. It looks like I painted a red circle in the middle of my line, but I didn't. It is not a big circle, but it is an example of the bug. On the right is a line drawn by drawing as hard as I feel comfortable drawing on the tablet. The circle is larger than the thickest possible line I can produce naturally from my drawing tablet.

This one is minor and I would probably ignore it or maybe not even notice it. However, sometimes the circle is much larger. The largest circle I've seen covered a significant portion of the page, but usually they are usually just annoyingly large and ugly.

I can't update my program right now, but I will be able to in about a week. If this is not a known problem, I highly doubt it has been solved.

image.png

Here is a copy of the PDF with this line. I was messing around with it and this circle is very strange. While the rest of the pen stroke maintains its width when it is resized, the size of the circle increases and decreases as the line is extended vertically, but if you make the line too long, the circle vanishes.

New Document.pdf

[Daniel - PDF-XChange]

Hello, Zarquan314

Looking at the document, and the line you have draw here, it does not appear to be using a pressure based stoke type at all, as indicated by the perfect arrow point at the end:

image.png

Beyond that, however you have created this, resulted in a non-existent (so far as our software is aware) stoke mode to be used, as that is listed as "custom" instead of "auto" (which our pressure based mode uses) or one of the default styles. Changing the style in use seems to resolve the issue:

image1.png

While I cannot identify from this what caused the problem, I can offer a workaround. Simply ensure that before writing with the pencil tool, you have chosen a static stroke mode to write with, then pressure and other input from your tablet should be ignored entirely.

Kind regards,

[Zarquan314]

This was created using the standard pressure stoke setting, as I only use that setting. This was a quick stroke. One thing that is mildly interesting is how the line interacts with the eraser tool. If you erase the very bottom of the line, the circle instantly vanishes. Looking at the bottom, it is almost like the pen stroke is folding in on itself, and it rounds itself off as soon as I erase the tip. If you start from the top, it vanishes after a certain point a decent distance away from the circle.

Due to this, perhaps smoothness settings are related. I set mine to be as precise as possible, which I believe is Low smoothness. I find any other smoothness setting annoying, as they make my 2's and 3's lose detail.

I like the pressure stroke, as it allows me to write smaller when needed and still be legible without having to change settings. My hope is that we can identify what is causing this error.

[Daniel - PDF-XChange]

Hello, Zarquan314

I understand, At the moment I cannot make any promises, but I have shown this to the dev team, and they are surprised to see this "bubble" present, as the lines data does not reflect that anything abnormal should be there at all. We have as such created a ticket for tracking this bug, and while it will not be fixed in time for the 361 release, we do hope to get it fixed in one of the next few following that.

It is internal only, but if you ask me about the progress of the ticket here, I can check to see if there are any updates for you.
RT#6024: Odd extraneous data in pencil tool.

Kind regards,

[PHK]

For what it's worth, I am customarily using a Wacom tablet (intuos Pro) and I cannot reproduce this sort of incorrect behavior in v. 360.

If I have Stroke set to Auto, I get a pencil line of the specified Stroke width regardless of sytlus pressure. If select one of the other non-Auto styles, I get pencil lines of various widths responsive to stylus pressure.

[Daniel - PDF-XChange]

Hello, PHK

It is likely to be directly related to the device model that Zarquan is using, hopefully we can find the cause from this document, but if not, our Dev team will reach out for more details as the investigation progresses.

Kind regards,

[Zarquan314]

If it helps, I am using a Wacom Intuos bluetooth tablet, size small.

I am almost certain that the issue is related to hitches in the program when drawing caused by running out of RAM and page swaps happening. If you want to replicate it, try opening way too many tabs in a web browser then using the program. I started getting them again after consciously not closing tabs and opening more than I usually do. I am terrible about closing tabs, so I run in to RAM problems fairly regularly (but I've trained myself to close most tabs on a regular basis).

I would like to note that I consider this a minor issue, but it would be nice to be solved. Someone with a computer with less RAM might encounter it more often.

[PHK]

...I am almost certain that the issue is related to hitches in the program when drawing caused by running out of RAM and page swaps happening. If you want to replicate it, try opening way too many tabs in a web browser then using the program. I started getting them again after consciously not closing tabs and opening more than I usually do. I am terrible about closing tabs, so I run in to RAM problems fairly regularly (but I've trained myself to close most tabs on a regular basis).
...

It never occurred to me that open tabs consume RAM as I usually have multiple tabs open but never have a RAM problem. Maybe I have too much RAM. But interesting...

[Daniel - PDF-XChange]

Hello, PHK

Web browser tabs are notorious for keeping a large presence in your active RAM consumption. Chrome is one of the bigger "well known" offenders there, Firefox only seems to have issues when you have extensions installed, and surprisingly Edge, despite being Chromium based (and a Microsoft product), is very good about managing its memory footprint, actively "disabling" unused tabs to conserve memory until you re-visit them. If someone is running into memory problems due to poor tab handling habits, I would recommend that they give Edge a try, these days it really is use a more stable, and proven to be faster browser.

Our editor on the other hand is usually quite good about not consuming an excessive amount of RAM for each document you have open, this is a big part of why we do not hold a full copy of the file in memory, but instead lock the original document and access it during use, it results in massive memory handling relief.

Back to the topic at hand, I will forward these details to the Dev team members investigating the issue, they should be able to easily test reproducing the issue in an environment where the PC is "a bit bogged down". With that said, our software, like most, is not designed to be used in an environment where resources that we need are not readily available. We manage our own memory footprint, but it is on the other applications you are using, and you yourself, to ensure that your system resources are not 100% in use, if you do not wish to experience memory induced stuttering within most applications, ours included.

Kind regards,

[PHK]

Thanks for that discussion of tabs and RAM. My post was meant in the context of PDF-XCE only and I would not want to broaden the discussion to the myriad of exogenous things that could impact RAM consumption. But I am glad to understand a little bit better how PDF-XCE manages our user resources.

[Zarquan314]

I agree that PDF XChange Editor uses a reasonable amount of RAM. I have never had an issue, even with dozens of papers open. But I think it's data can be swapped out with too many tabs open, which can cause small hitches in the program, and I think this causes the issue.

When my browser uses too much RAM, all my programs develop hitches. That is one of my cues to close tabs. Mostly, its a minor annoyance that is resolved within a few seconds or minutes of closing my tabs. In PDF XChange Editor, it is a larger minor annoyance due to these weird circles. And on computers with less RAM, it might be more common.

I don't expect your devs to solve the "low RAM = hitching" problem. I think side effects from these hitches will continue to exist, but I do hope they can find a way to make the circles not appear as a result. Things like loss of precision during a hitch are probably existential unsolvable problems, but in the grand scheme of things are pretty minor, as these hitches are barely noticeable (duration of a small fraction of a second).

[Vasyl - PDF-XChange]

Hi Zarquan.

Seems we found the reason of the trouble: tiny twitches at the end of the line may cause appearing such strange dots.
This issue will be fixed in the 361 build. Please check this new build and let us know about the result. Thanks.

Cheesr.

[Zarquan314]

Thank you very much! I will try out the new build when it comes out.

[Stefan - PDF-XChange]

Hello Zarquan314,

Build 361 is now out - so please do give it a try!

Kind regards,
Stefan

[Zarquan314]

OK, I've downloaded it. I have a ton of browser tabs open and I have papers to mark, so I should be able to tell if it is still happening.

[Daniel - PDF-XChange]

[Zarquan314]

I spent the day grading with around 85-97% ram usage. There were definitely hitches in the program (something I can't expect you to solve), but as far as I can tell, there were no circles. I believe the problem has been solved. Thank you very much.

If I see any more circles, I will be sure to post it here.

[Paul - PDF-XChange]

[PHK]

Although I do not have a RAM problem (I am typically using less than 60%), I see that my e-mail app is the second greediest RAM consumer after my browser. PDF-XCE comes in a distant third. Perhaps that sort of thing might be true for you, too, Zarquan If so and if you aren't reading your e-mails at the same time as when you are grading papers, you might be able to shut down temporarily your e-mail app to free-up RAM for your grading sessions.

[Dimitar - PDF-XChange]

Hi,

If any of you still have performance issues ( our Editor eating too much RAM ), please follow these instructions and made a process log, and send it to us for investigation.

https://www.pdf-xchange.com/knowle ... cess-dump1


Regards,

[Zarquan314]

Although I do not have a RAM problem (I am typically using less than 60%), I see that my e-mail app is the second greediest RAM consumer after my browser. PDF-XCE comes in a distant third. Perhaps that sort of thing might be true for you, too, Zarquan If so and if you aren't reading your e-mails at the same time as when you are grading papers, you might be able to shut down temporarily your e-mail app to free-up RAM for your grading sessions.

I don't think PDF XChange Editor uses too much RAM or is responsible for the hitching issue. The hitching problem is universal. When I have too many tabs open, almost all of my programs have little hitches. If I don't use too many tabs, I don't have any problems.

I generally read email from my browser too. And I unfortunately need my browser open while I am grading.

When I was artificially opening too many tabs to trigger this issue, I probably had several hundred tabs open. These hitches are for a fraction of a second and I barely notice them, but they appear to be connected to the (as far as I can tell, solved) circle problem, which was annoying.

[Dimitar - PDF-XChange]

Thank you for the feedback.

If you experience any problems like that in the future please contact us again.

Thank you for using our products.

Regards.